Petitions Committee

Moving on to item 3, new petitions, on the agenda, I'll go to 3.1, P-06-1185, 'Introduce a minimum 3 year residency requirement for all Senedd Election candidates'.

'There have been several high profile cases of Senedd candidates standing or being elected, despite having never lived in Wales.

'We propose Elected members of the Senedd should be required to have lived in Wales for a minimum of 3 years prior to candidacy, in order that they understand the communities they seek to represent.

'We believe parachuting of candidates from outside of Wales, into the Senedd, undermines the quality and integrity of Welsh politics and must be prevented.'

This was submitted by James Davies, with 2,682 signatures. I will look to Members to discuss any actions, and I'll go to Joel James.

Yes, thank you, Chair. I'm conscious you mentioned the two of them being linked together, with the next petition. I'll be honest, I don't particularly like petitions like this, because I've never felt that where someone lives determines how good you are as an elected representative. I'm conscious that some people might say, 'Well, you need to know the issues of where you're standing', and there are issues there. For example, we've seen it before where a candidate who—. I'm only using this, Buffy, as an example because it's near me in the Rhondda, so, as I was saying, ideally you want someone born and bred in the Rhondda who will know the issues, and it's the same in Pontypridd, it's the same—. But, they could still be terrible Members of Parliament or terrible Members of the Senedd, or whatever, and I'd rather have a good one who's from England or Scotland than a bad one who lives right next door to me, you know? And I don't like this attitude of putting a residency limit, especially in the way this has been done, I think. It's made reference to high-profile candidates, and everything. It's almost as if they don't necessarily agree with their politics rather than where they come from, and that's why they don't want them standing.

If it was up to me, I would just thank the petitioner and close it, but I am conscious of that review that the Welsh Government's doing—you know, the constitutional review going forward. If this is something that the committee is mindful of, just to pass it on to them, I'd be supportive of that. I just don't like the nature of these petitions, if I'm honest.

Okay, thank you for that, Joel. Luke, you wanted to come in too.

Diolch, Gadeirydd. I just want to pick up on something that Joel said there, and I hope it provides some clarity. From my understanding of the petitions, they're not saying that if you're English, you shouldn't be allowed to stand in the Welsh Parliament. It's talking about a residency period for living in Wales, and I do agree that that is quite important. Having lived in the communities and grown up in the communities, I think you're best placed to represent those communities. And that, of course, is extended to people who might have come from England or Scotland, as Joel pointed out, and have lived in those communities for a while. So, I just want to make the point that this isn't talking about excluding English or Scottish people from standing for Parliament, because if they've called Wales their home, then it's their home, and they should have the right to stand there as well as any other Welsh person.

I would agree with Joel's suggestion, however, that we pass this on to the committee on Senedd reform, because I think this would be quite an important thing for them to consider, amongst other matters as well, as we look to shape the Senedd for the future.

Okay. Joel, you wanted to come in and then I'll bring Buffy in.

Thank you, Chair, and it was just to touch upon what Luke said. I'm cynical maybe, but the thing that stuck out with me is that it says in the petition text,

'We believe parachuting of candidates from outside of Wales, into the Senedd, undermines the quality and integrity of Welsh politics and must be prevented.'

And I think that can only be taken one way, really, because why a three-year residency limit? Why not a five-year residency? Why not just a one-year residency? And that's what I don't like about these petitions, and that's why I'm not supportive of it. But I'm conscious of where we are, that they're looking into the constitutional arrangements of it—again, something I'm not necessarily supportive of—and there's an avenue there where this could be properly investigated, should people think that way.

Okay, thanks, Joel. Buffy, I'll bring you in and then we'll move to actioning the petition.

Just to say I agree with what Luke said. I think we need better clarity on this. So, I think we need to write to Ministers and have better clarity on this, I really do.

Thank you, Buffy. So, there was the suggestion to write to the Special Purpose Committee on Senedd Reform, which I think we're all in agreement with, even if we don't necessarily all share the same views on the petition itself. So, if we could action that, clerking team. I also think we can make them aware of this, but we can close the petition on that basis, and I can see agreement there.

Moving on to 3.2, P-06-1186, 'Prevent anyone who hasn't lived in Wales for at least 6 months from standing in Senedd elections'. This was submitted by Owen Sullivan with 143 signatures. I'm conscious of the discussion we've just had, which surrounds many of the same points here. So, I'll propose as Chair the same action for this petition as the previous one, 3.1. Do Members agree? They are in agreement. Great.

So, item 3.3, P-06-1206, 'Review Welsh General Practice Access standards in light of pandemic'.

'GPs in Wales have been set an unachievable target of answering 90% of calls within 2 minutes in order to receive full funding. This is nigh on impossible to achieve under normal circumstances but due to increased demand and staff shortages this is unrealistic during a pandemic.'

Additional details were sent with this petition, and there was a link for Members to read prior to the committee. This was submitted by Michele Richards, with 516 signatures, and I'll ask Members to discuss any actions they wish to take on this. Luke.

Diolch, Gadeirydd. I just wanted to make the point here that I recognise Welsh Government has extended the funding to help compensate for the issues around the pandemic in this particular petition, and I'm conscious as well that the BMA general practice committee have been party to those negotiations as well. I think, in terms of what the petition is asking, it has been somewhat addressed by the Welsh Government extending that funding. So, I would suggest that we, of course, thank the petitioner and close the petition on that point, as I think that a lot of it has been addressed so far. Of course, there will be scope, I think, for us as Members to come back to this on an individual basis outside this committee to scrutinise how well that funding was used and how effective it was, but, for the time being, I think we should look to close the petition and thank the petitioner.

Okay, thanks for that suggestion. I can see Members are in agreement with that.

So, moving on to 3.4, P-06-1207, 'Start referring to Welsh cities and towns by their Welsh names'.

'The Senedd, and other bodies, should start using Welsh terms if they want to successfully increase the use of the Welsh language, they must set an example to others. Instead of referring to Caerdydd by it’s English given name, 'Cardiff', use it’s Welsh name instead. After all, speaking Welsh in Wales is no longer a crime - is it not?

'“Do as I say, not as I do” it’s time to lead by example'

This was submitted by Madison Lorraine, with 108 signatures. And I'm sure, as Madison could say, I'm currently learning Welsh.

Dwi'n dysgu siarad Cymraeg.

So, that's my little bit, and I'll ask Members to discuss this topic. Buffy.

First, I'd like to thank the petitioner. This is a really important issue. I note that Cadw and the Welsh Language Commissioner are already undertaking significant work on this issue, so I suggest we note this petition and then close this petition.

Okay, thank you, Buffy. Joel, you wanted to come in, and I'll bring Luke in just afterwards.

Thank you, Chair. Obviously, I declare an interest here in the sense that, being an RCT councillor—I just want to refer to something—I used to sit on the Welsh language steering committee there, and this caused no end of debate there, because what we were finding was that we had the Welsh Language Commissioner and various academics based in Bangor sending us a document of what we needed to now call our place names and street names in Wales, based on academic standards or whatever. What we were finding was that these names weren't taking into account local variations or local dialects or local spellings. For example, where I live now, I represent the village of Efail Isaf. There are two ways of spelling it: you spell it either as two words or one word—you know, 'Efail Isaf', or you join them together. When we were building the bypass—well, when the council was building the bypass—they decided to bring all new signage, and so they changed 'Efail Isaf' from the two words down to one. Now, that's caused no end of debate in my area, because some people were saying, 'Well, actually, yes, that's correct now—that's what it's called,' and then you had other people saying, 'Well, actually, no, it's always been called "Efail Isaf". It might sound similar but there are two separate meanings if you split the words'. And that's the fundamental issue I have with this, in the sense of having this top-down approach. I don't particularly like it. It doesn't take into account local variations.

And another thing—I'm going to get on my high horse here, so apologies for this—I don't particularly like is the message it sends when we say that the Welsh and English languages have equal status. Because what I'm seeing, again in my council capacity, is, for example, we have new housing estates being built and they've all got to have Welsh street names. I've got no issue with that, but what's happening now is that we've got the old English street names being made bilingual. So, we have people going around taking down 'Queen's Drive' and 'St Anne's Drive' and all that, and then putting a brand new sign up that has it in Welsh, and underneath that, it has it in English, which I think is a pointless exercise and I don't particularly like it. What will happen is that at some point in the future, that will just become a Welsh language street name, and that's what I don't necessarily like. It's saying now, 'From now on, this is a Welsh language street name' without any say whatsoever from the people who live there or whatever. And we're having issues where the street name has been changed into a Welsh language one, but they're still referring to it as the old English language street name, so that's causing no end of confusion, especially with delivery drivers and everything. Sorry, this has touched a nerve with me. It's just, again, like with the previous petition, I don't like why it's been submitted.

Okay, thank you, Joel. Luke.

Diolch, Gadeirydd. If I could pick up on Joel's last point there in terms of bilingual street names eventually becoming Welsh language-only street names, for me, that's ideal. I mean, when we talk about street names in Wales, there's a lot of meaning when we talk about Welsh language street names, the stories behind them. And an ideal example, although it's not a street, it's still an ideal example, is Llyn Bochlwyd, which was changed to Lake Australia, well, there's a story behind Llyn Bochlwyd; if I remember off the top of my head, it's relating to how a deer jumped into the lake to hide from hunters—I won't go into the full story now, because I might actually be telling the wrong story. But there's a point here, and at a time, as well, when we have, for example, houses in north and west Wales that have had long-standing Welsh names changed to English names—you know, some great examples of some really old, traditional Welsh names turning into 'Summer House' or something like that, which is ironic in its own way, I think this actual petition is quite apt. For me, it's important that we don't forget that the Welsh language was here far before the English language and every Welsh language street name tells a story.

The particular examples that Joel might've used there, they could've been examples of when street names were being made way before legislation on Welsh language was brought into force. I would be interested, on a personal level and I hope that the committee would agree with this, in what the Welsh Language Commissioner's views would be on this, not just for my own benefit, but it would be useful, I think, to be able to feed this back to the petitioner as well. I think it's important that we do remember that the Welsh language has a history in Wales and a lot of the streets in Wales and Welsh language names have a lot of history behind them and there's a reason and a story there and I think it's important that we recognise that and remember that.

Sorry, Chair, but if I can just cut in there, I agree with what Luke said there, but also, the English language has had its impact in Wales, has its story to tell. It's the same with street names, you know, we have like 'King's Street' or 'Queen's Avenue' or 'Queen's Drive', there's a story behind that, then, and why that was specifically—. You know, it's like 'Boulevard de Nantes' in Cardiff; I don't see the point of having that, then, in Welsh, because there's a reason why that was called Boulevard de Nantes. That's just my own opinion. And again, with the Welsh Language Commissioner, I've said it before, I don't like that top-down approach. I think Luke has touched upon that as well with Lake Australia, you know, someone's decided to take it upon themselves to say, 'Well, no, no, from now on, this is what it's going to be called' without any real thought to local opinion, and that's what just doesn't sit right with me.

Thanks. So, there was—. Luke, very quickly because we're—

Very quickly, because I understand that we're running tight on time here. There is a point there, of course, that there are some Welsh language street names that are being changed to English. My own street of Pant Glas, for example, the translation became 'Green Valley' and that's now being used on Google, for example. And that changing of street names through Google into English names is what drives a lot of that cultural shift, really, to start referring to them as their English names. So, I think it's important that we recognise that and that we do legislate to ensure that those Welsh language names are the only ones that are being used, rather than making them bilingual just for that point. Sorry, Chair, I took some time there.

I'll indulge you, don't worry, Luke. So, there was a suggestion there from Luke to write to the Welsh Language Commissioner on this. I can see nodding in agreement with that so, yes, okay, we'll action that and move forward.

Item 3.5, P-06-1210, 'Stop the Welsh Government introducing a blanket 20mph speed limit'.

'Speed limits should be set by local authorities and should be only 20mph where necessary.'

This was submitted by Stephen R Matthews with 161 signatures. I'd like to invite Members to discuss this further. Joel.

Yes, thank you, Chair. I speak as someone whose ward has benefited from the introduction of 20 mph. I think there are positives, but again I do have some concerns about the blanket ban of it. I don't necessarily think we need to stop it, because we've had a Welsh election and one of the manifesto pledges was to introduce this. I think it is broadly supported, but I definitely think there's scope to try and find more information about the logistics of it in terms of those exemptions they have talked about, but then also about the funding and how it is going to be funded and how traffic calming measures are going to be funded, what sort of extra money is being provided for that. I'm definitely keen to find more information on that.

Okay, so the Deputy Minister has been clear that there will be some exemption process within there, so as a committee we can write to find out that information, if Members agree. Yes, thank you. Cheers. Thanks, Joel.

Item 3.6, P-06-1211, 'Remove the average speed cameras and 50mph speed limit on the M4 between Newport and Cardiff'.

'The government is pressing ahead with the installation of average speed cameras and a new 50mph speed limit on the M4 between Newport and Cardiff. They claim to reduce accidents, pollution and ease congestion. We...demand the immediate reversal of this policy. The investment should go into green initiatives that benefit not restrict the public. The best way to ease congestion is to increase supply (such as building additional lanes or bypass road), not reduce demand— damaging the economy.'

This was submitted by Michael Slade with 145 signatures. Again, I'll invite Members to discuss this petition. Luke, please.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. I think we should note the petitioner's concerns, but there is an element there where the petitioner talks about increasing capacity on roads—there is evidence out there to suggest that that wouldn't be the solution, through the induced demand theory. I also recognise as well, of course, Welsh Government's ambition and the core tenets of their transport strategy being around clean air and the environment. We've seen that the Welsh Government have no plans to remove the average speed cameras at present. I think, again, this would be down to us as Members to take up, if we so please. I'm personally in agreement with the Welsh Government on this. On that basis, I would like to potentially close the petition, if Members agree, but of course thank the petitioner and ensure that his comments are noted.

Thank you, Luke. So, there's been a suggestion to close this petition and a plea for individual Members in the Senedd to take this up within the Chamber. Members are in agreement.

So, moving on to 3.7, P-06-1213, 'Ban leisure use of Seadoo/jet ski in Cymru. Except in strictly controlled designated areas'.

'Our wildlife and their habitats are already under savage attack from creeping civilisation, resource exploitation, pollution and climate change. To allow the uncontrolled use of these noisy, dangerous, polluting leisure vehicles, to add to that damage is irresponsible! They offer no other service to mankind other than a fleeting spasm of excitement. This is both wasteful and irresponsible.'

This was submitted by Richard Jenkins, with 1,432 signatures. I'll invite Members to discuss this topic. Buffy.

Firstly, I'd like to thank the petitioner. There is already a consultation under way on this and this will be published in around three months' time. So, I think that we should wait and see what the consultation says, and in the meantime, write to the Welsh Local Government Association and see if there has been any co-ordination between maritime and local authorities on this subject. But, I think that we should leave the petition open. I don't think that we should close this petition.

Okay. Thank you, Buffy. Any other comments from Members? I can see you nodding in agreement. Okay, so, thanks for the suggestion, Buffy, and the clerking team will certainly take that forward on our behalf.

Item 4 on today's agenda: updates to previous petitions. Item 4.1, P-05-912, 'Supporting Families with Sudden and Unexpected Death in Children and Young Adults'. This was submitted by Rhian Mannings, with 5,682 signatures, and it was something that we debated just less than two weeks ago now. I will invite Members to discuss this petition, and I will bring in Joel James, please.

Thank you, Chair. Yes, as you said, we had the debate in the Chamber a couple of weeks back—no, last week, sorry—to hear all the experiences. I thought that you, Chair, spoke brilliantly about it as well. I definitely think that that got everybody's attention who was listening to the debate, and you managed to secure media coverage of it as well.

It is an extremely important issue, and I have got to admit that I was quite pleased with the response of the Welsh Government—to work closely with Rhian Mannings, and its wish to get this sorted, really. I suppose that it's down to us, maybe as individual Members, to hold the Government to account on that, to make sure that that does happen.

I note from the report that one of the suggestions, now, is just to thank the petitioner and to congratulate them, and to close it then and use it as a sort of successful case to go forward. I think that, yes, that's a very good suggestion, and I'm supportive of that.

Thank you for your kind words there, Joel, and I think that everyone spoke well in that debate, right across the Chamber, and the Minister. So, I think that you are correct. I think that I would like to put on the record, for all of the committee and the previous committee under the chairship of Janet Finch-Saunders as well, our thanks to Rhian Mannings, especially, for the inspirational work that she has done.

Of course, we will, if Rhian accepts our offer, make this a case study of what the petitions process is about for the people of Wales—to make a good, positive change for the people of Wales in times that there is no light for certain people. Hopefully, we can offer that sense of light and warmth in the darkest and coldest of their times. But, I would also like to put on record, from the members of the committee, our thanks to Mared and our clerking team, and the team behind the scenes, for what they have done to secure that support. Without them, it simply wouldn't be possible.

Moving on to item 4.2, P-05-1078, 'Increase funding for mental health services and improve waiting times for people needing help in crisis. We need a change!' This was submitted by Laura Williams, with 5,159 signatures, and I will invite Members to discuss it. Luke.

Diolch, Gadeirydd. I think that it's important for us to recognise now that it will take some time for the Welsh Government's approach to providing 24-hour appropriate support or response to people suffering from mental health—it will take time for that to embed properly. I think that it's important, actually, that we write to both the Chair of the Finance Committee and the Chair of the health committee, to ask that the evidence and correspondence that we have collated in relation to this petition is considered in any future scrutiny of the Welsh Government's mental health policies.

I would just like, as well, to take the opportunity to thank Laura for sharing her experiences. I think that it is very important that we get these examples and these case studies, so that we can then better tailor services for those who are going to be using them. Of course, I'd like to thank her as well for championing other people who are struggling to access appropriate mental health support, and representing them via the Petitions Committee.

Having said that, of course, as I said at the start of my contribution, it will take time for the Welsh Government's approach now to embed properly, and so I think, for the time—. Well, I think, actually, the time now has come, really, to, of course, thank Laura for submitting the petition, and to close that petition as well.

Thank you, Luke, and I can see Members don't want to add anything further to that and agree with your comments. I would agree with you as well—I do want to put on record our thanks to Laura for, again, another inspirational—someone using their own personal experiences. And I certainly will, as an individual Member, as many of us will, be looking at this closely. I think my views are very close to the petitioner's views on the current state of the services. So, I will certainly be keeping a close eye on that, and I commit to doing that. But, thank you, Laura. And we wish her every—best wishes in the future.

Item 4.3, 'Introduce Personal Health Budgets and Personalised Care in Wales'. This was submitted by Rhys Bowler with 779 signatures. I'll now invite Members to discuss this petition and any actions. Buffy Williams.

Firstly, I'd like to thank the petitioner. I've read the letters that he submitted and they were very personal letters. I know the previous health Minister has made a commitment to looking at different options, and there's also been a working group set up. I think we should write to the new health Minister and find out what exactly is going on and get an update then on this issue. I think it's really important that we do this.

Thank you for that, Buffy. I can see nodding from Members on the screen. Yes, I am in agreement too; we should write to the new health Minister in the Welsh Government and seek that update.

Item 4.4, P-05-1161, 'Routine collection and publication of data of how many babies/children return to their care experienced parents care at the end of a Parent and Child Placement'. This was submitted by Nicola Jones with 60 signatures, and I'll invite Members to discuss the petition. I look at Joel James.

Thank you, Chair. And I know, when we discussed this previously, there was some—not confusion, but we just basically needed a bit more understanding of what the petitioner wanted from us with the petition, and I am grateful to the research department for doing that scoping paper. And it's raised quite a few interesting issues in terms of—hang on, where's my notes—issues such as why care-experienced parents are overrepresented in the care and child protection proceedings. I definitely think there's probably more to look more into, really. I know one of the recommendations is whether or not the committee could accept the scoping paper, which I hope we do, and then take direct evidence from care-experienced parents and local authorities and the Children and Family Court Advisory and Support Service amongst others. I definitely think that's probably something to do. I think it would be quite interesting to do, actually, as well.

Thank you for that suggestion, Joel. Are Members in agreement? I know, Luke, you were keen, when this last came to the committee; I can see you nodding there. Okay, so I think what we'll do, we will accept the recommendation, we'll thank the research team for preparing the scoping paper for us, and we will look at pushing that forward into our future work programme as a committee for some time in the new year when we do that. And I think it is key, actually, that we do seek, first-hand, from care-experienced parents and some of the bodies that you suggested as well.

Moving on, item 4.5, P-05-949, 'SAVE COWBRIDGE OLD GIRLS’ SCHOOL FROM DEMOLITION'. This was submitted by Sara Pedersen with 5,541 signatures, and I'll invite Members to discuss this petition. Can I bring Luke in, please?

Diolch, Cadeirydd. I understand this petition has been discussed several times in committee already, and we've corresponded with the Welsh Government several times on this. However, I am also aware that the previous committee had referred this petition for debate in the previous Senedd, although it wasn't prioritised towards the end of the previous Senedd because of the COVID pandemic. I am conscious as well, of course, that this petition has reached the threshold for a debate in the Chamber. So, I would be minded to recommend that we do refer this petition for debate in the Chamber, as we do set these thresholds out, and, when petitions meet them, I think it's important that we hold our end of the bargain up and follow through with the targets that we've set. I'm conscious of other members on this committee who might have a different view; I know Joel, of course, might want to come in on this.

Yes. Joel.

Yes. Thank you, Chair. I'd just like to agree with Luke there and to put this to debate. Obviously, I've mentioned in previous meetings that I've been contacted by this group, and, subsequently, since the last Petitions Committee meeting, I've actually met them on site. And it's so frustrating that we have this building here, which has played such an important role in the early education of female students here. And one of the interesting facts here: it had its own purpose-built laboratories for secondary school girls—the first in the UK to do it, I think. And it also had its own boarding accommodation, so those girls who were too poor to travel to school could stay there and still get the education for free.

And it's just so frustrating that, yet again, we've got important community buildings here, where you've got the local community trying to protect it and meeting with the developers to come up with solutions that see the site saved but then still used for the housing that the developers want, and there's just frustration that there doesn't seem to be any wiggle room. I'm conscious of what the Minister has said, that Cadw have said 'no', but, when you look at all the evidence, all the historic societies are saying, 'Can you please look at this again because we think you are wrong?' And it touches upon what I've said previously about that top-down approach. I don't want to badmouth academics, but there are some academics in a room, or whatever, looking at the blueprints and that, and saying, 'Oh, you know, no', and there's no accountability on that decision, and that's what frustrates me.

When we're looking at—. Again, if you look to England, they're bringing in the Localism Act 2011, which gives communities a greater say in trying to purchase these buildings and to protect them. It's just so frustrating when you've got a well-organised community campaign—it's not against the housing proposals being built; they just want to save the building. And they've even gone out and got housing plans drafted up for the developers. And if I remember rightly, from looking at them, they would provide more housing on site. But there's just no interaction whatsoever between them anymore, I don't think. So, I would be supportive of this going to debate—I think it's quite important. And if it does, I'd probably be talking not just on this, but I'd be talking about other examples that we're getting, where the local community is just being bypassed and not listened to.

Okay. Thank you, Joel, for that. Buffy, do you have any particular view? Mared first. Sorry, Buffy.

I know you've got—. I just wanted to clarify a point Luke mentioned earlier about debates. In the standards for petitions, it's about that the committee should consider referring petitions for debate if they reach the number; it's not automatic. So, it's just to clarify that, in case it's confusing for people who watch.

Thank you. I will bring Luke back in, and then I'll bring you in, Buffy. Luke.

Sorry, I just wanted to thank Mared for that clarification. That was my understanding of it, of course, as well—my point, of course, being that it is important that we at least refer; whether the Business Committee then agrees with us is another matter. But I think it's important that we stick to our end of the bargain at least, and refer.

Buffy.

I just wanted to say that I agree with what Luke said at the beginning—I totally support Luke's take on this.

Okay. Well, thank you for that. I must say that, as Chair—but I can see I'm outvoted on this one, so it's fine—I'm unsure as to what a debate will secure, given the Minister's crystal-clear response and the new change in Government. But I will take the committee's lead, as the Chair should, at this time, so we can refer to debate on this particular issue.

Item 4.6, P-05-895, 'Rosa's Legacy: introduce a scheme to help people access veterinary care for their companion animals'. This was submitted by Linda Joyce Jones with 95 signatures. And again, I will ask Members to discuss this petition and any actions. Buffy Williams.

Thank you, Chair. Firstly, I'd like to thank the petitioner. I know that the animal welfare plan, the Welsh Government's animal welfare plan, was released on 4 November, but there's still an awful lot of work to be done in this area. So, I think we need to write to the Minister one more time, again, just for clarity on this, and to put the petitioner's points across. Because there are so many people out there whose animals, whose pets, are so important to them. They bring so much joy to people's lives. I think it's really important that we get clarity on this subject.

Thank you, Buffy. Luke.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. Can I say I agree with Buffy there? I think we should definitely write to the Minister one more time. There is a lot of work that still needs to be done on the animal welfare plan. This is one of them, which I happen to agree with, but that's on a personal level. Some of the work around greyhound welfare that I've been undertaking, relating to the animal welfare plan—. I am conscious, however—. I'm asking if this can be in addition to Buffy's suggestion; I hope she doesn't mind me adding to her suggestion. I am conscious we have written to the Welsh Government four times, and that we ourselves, as a committee, have considered this petition six times. I think now that the animal welfare plan has been released by Welsh Government it falls on us now, as individual Members in the Senedd, outside of this committee, to now scrutinise it and push for those improvements. So, I would also like to add the suggestion that we thank the petitioner and close the petition.

Well, I would agree with both of those, and I can see nodding elsewhere as well. So, okay, we'll take both of those points. We will write that one final time, but we will thank the petitioner as well, and feed back that information to the petitioner. And, of course, members not only of the committee, but Members of the Senedd and members of the public, will be able to see that correspondence and use it as they see fit in due course.

Item 4.7, P-05-1040, 'Introduce a moratorium on the approval any new large scale waste incinerators in Wales'. And this was submitted by Amanda Jenner with 938 signatures. And I'll ask Members—. Joel James.

Thank you, Chair. Just to say, like the last time we debated this petition, I believe that I know the petitioner, Amanda, and I just wanted to touch upon—. Because I know that she was calling for a moratorium on the approval of any new large scale waste incinerators, and I'm conscious of the 'Beyond Recycling' strategy that the Welsh Government has launched now, which addresses that, I believe. And, from looking at the notes, it seems the petitioner hasn't made any further comments when we've gone back to her about that. So, I think that we should welcome the further information that we've received and the clarification regarding the process, and then maybe look to congratulate the petitioner on a successful outcome and to close the petition.

Again, I can see agreement with that. So, diolch yn fawr, Joel. It was a successful petition. Again, it's a good outcome for the petitions process. I do thank the petitioner for submitting it, those who signed it, but also the backroom team of our committee for their good work, again, on this petition.

Item 4.8, P-05-1112, 'Help Welsh Communities Buy Community Assets: Implement Part 5 Chapter 3 of the Localism Act 2011', submitted by Daniel Evans with 655 signatures. And I look to Members to discuss this petition. Luke Fletcher.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. I'm just going to be safe here and say I might know Dan—it may be a completely different Dan Evans who is in Bridgend—so just in case it's one of them, I'll be safe. I looked through the correspondence that we had with Welsh Government last night, and I have it in front of me right here now, and, of course, in September, as a committee—well, a new committee then—we wrote to the Welsh Government to request an update on where they were with the research on this topic. And the Minister responded saying that, and I'm quoting here, there will soon be an internal meeting to discuss the report, and that she anticipated that this would be followed by a meeting

'with external partners including the WLGA, One Voice Wales and third sector representatives.'

I hope the committee would agree, but I think we should request an update from the Minister following those meetings, I think, if they've already happened, on how she intends to take this forward, and keep the petition open, of course, pending a response from the Minister.

Diolch, Luke. And I see nodding in agreement with that suggestion. Joel.

Yes. Thank you, Chair. It touches upon what I said earlier about the previous commission—petition, sorry. And I note in the report that, in England, they've had 10 years of this legislation, and it's just a bit frustrating, personally, that it's still not coming through. But it looks like it's getting that way, and so I just support what Luke said there and what he's proposed, and I think it's definitely something—. Because it's the whole thing about devolution, I suppose: it's about empowering local communities, and that's something I believe in, whether—I'm conscious of my views about the Senedd—whether or not it happens through the body that's here that's another matter, and I won’t go into that. But, it’s all about empowering local communities, and I definitely think this is a way to go about doing it.

Okay, I think there's agreement on the action taken there as well. So, thanks for that.

Item 4.9, P-06-1160, ‘Require local Welsh exam centres to accept home-educated students for public exams’, and this was submitted by Claire Woolley with 393 signatures, and I’ll invite Members to discuss this petition. And I’ll bring in Buffy Williams.

Thank you, Chair. I’d like to write to the Minister one more time on this petition, if we could, please, just to have complete clarity, because I actually don’t think the Minister is answering the question that’s being asked. There are lots and lots and lots of different reasons why children are home schooled, and I don't think it’s fair that parents are penalised by having to pay for exams if children are home schooled for specific reasons. So, I think we need to write to the Minister one more time and get clarity on this petition, if we could, please.

Okay. Thank you, Buffy. There's been a suggestion to write to the Minister, and I can see all Members nodding in agreement and agreeing with the strength of feeling you delivered there.

Item 4.10, P-06-1163, ‘Extend the postgraduate STEMM bursary to all MSc students in Wales’, and this was submitted by Rachel Wrathall with 88 signatures, and I look to Members to discuss this petition, and I'll bring in Joel James.

Thank you, Chair, and thank you for allowing us to talk about such an important issue as well. There does seem an element of frustration that the Government just aren’t moving on this one, but I definitely think it’s something to keep pushing at, and I know one of the recommendations is to refer to the children and young person’s committee in the Senedd, and I definitely think that’s a must. I think we need to keep pushing on this. It’s an important issue, and we just need to keep plugging away at it. So, I hope you don’t mind, Chair, if that’s what we can do with it.

Thank you, Joel. I too, for the record, have brought this particular petition and another example of something similar to this happening to the Minister on the floor of the Senedd in my role as a Member of this Senedd. So, I am, too, keen, and I do have a strength of feeling about this particular petition. So, I agree with Joel. I think we should perhaps send it to the Chair of the Children, Young People, and Education Committee, through there, and ask them to look at this particular issue during their scrutiny of the tertiary, education and research Bill. I know Buffy’s a member of that committee, so I’m sure she could fly the flag for petitions when they do scrutinise that particular Bill, and we can bring it back to committee and see where we are after Stage 1 of the scrutiny by the Children, Young People, and Education Committee.

Moving on, item 4.11, P-06-1178, ‘Free school meals for all pupils in Wales’, and I’ll invite Members to discuss—.Oh, I apologise, I jumped ahead just slightly, so I do send my apologies to Adam Johannes, with 980 signatures, but I will now invite Members to discuss this petition, and I’ll bring in Luke.

Diolch, Cadeirydd. Of course, this is an important subject that’s quite close to my heart as well, as somebody was in receipt of free school meals when I was a kid. I think there’s a fundamental thing here. Whilst benefits aren’t devolved, and my view on what should happen in terms of the welfare state in the Welsh context is quite clear—. Whilst those benefits aren’t devolved, free school meals is one of the few tools that Welsh Government have to directly impact children living in poverty.

I understand some of the comments made by the Minister relating to the cost of free school meals. Again, as I mentioned earlier in the UBI evidence session, sometimes I think that’s a red herring, because there are inherent savings in some of these policies that aren’t considered in that cost. I do think there’s an important thing here though, for us as a Petitions Committee, and that is that the petitioner’s views and examples that he’s submitted have been recognised by the Minister and will be used in this review. I think that's a positive thing that we should be very happy about, and I hope we can congratulate the petitioner on that point. And, of course, we know that the eligibility review is happening right now. I'd be minded—and I hope members of the committee would agree—to keep this petition open for the time being, so that we can see the outcome of that eligibility review, so that we have a more complete story to tell the petitioner here and, hopefully, will be able to show where his examples have been used in that review.

Ultimately, I do think now it is down to us as Members of the Senedd to push this further. Of course, my own party has held a debate on this several times in the Chamber, and I will of course be continuously scrutinising Welsh Government, as I said, as somebody who was in receipt of free school meals when I was a kid. But I think, just to wrap up, in terms of my suggestion, I would like to keep the petition open for the time being, pending the release of the recommendations from the review, so we can feed that back to the petitioner, and, of course, congratulate the petitioner on his examples being recognised by Welsh Government.

Okay. Diolch yn fawr, Luke, and I can see nodding in agreement. Are there any other comments? No. So, I'll take silence as an agreement of your suggestion, Luke. Okay.

Okay, that concludes today's public business. We will now go into a private session to consider, as I suggested before, the evidence we heard from Jonathan, the co-founder of the Universal Basic Income Lab Cymru, on our petition on universal basic income and to discuss how we will take that forward into the next session on 29 November, where the Future Generations Commissioner for Wales will be in front of the committee giving evidence, along with some other bodies and organisations who are interested in these proposals.

So, I do therefore propose, in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix), that the committee resolves to meet in private for the next item, item 6. Are Members content? I can see they are. So, diolch yn fawr for that. As I said, the committee will next meet on 29 November. I thank all Members today for their contributions. I thank our teams behind the scenes, as always, and I, of course, thank Jonathan for his time this afternoon. So, diolch yn fawr, and see you all in Plenary tomorrow. Cheers.